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Post by Cecil B. Deluxe on Apr 21, 2009 11:52:46 GMT -7
W Racing,currently our rules state "the slots in the block may be used" with the word "may" being the operative word. Our recent district derby showed the top six finishers with my two boys being in that top six all ran extended wheel bases. The father of the fourty first finisher out of fourty one entries raised the roof stating an unfair advantage, so that being said we have an upcoming district committee meeting to "reevaluate" the rules. I may be wrong but I think that the reason alot of the extended wheel base cars compete better at the District Level is because the builder has done a little more homework. You have to have done a little research to even know to try and extend the wheel base. Having said that, an experienced builder can make a shorter wheel base car go as fast or faster when using heavier wheels. If you look at the BSA cars that ran at East Coast Derby over the weekend, at least the top 5 were all short wheel base. Seems as though the long wheel base has a negative impact at some point. I am no expert, that was just my observation.
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Post by Ironhead on Apr 21, 2009 12:25:22 GMT -7
Hey Cecil you know your right,we have compared times for the past 4 years with the first 2 being short wheel base cars and the 2nd year car was not only a short wheel base car but we were still learning and we put the axle slot closer to the end as the front end and are you ready for this that car had the best time and fastest speed of even extended wheel cars we have made and the only thing I can see is he remained winning by the experience we gained from year to year and the extra TLC we gave to the axles and wheels.
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Post by Fat Boy on Apr 21, 2009 16:06:37 GMT -7
OLIITR !!
(old lady is in the room ! )
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Post by ACME Racing on Apr 21, 2009 17:18:04 GMT -7
The rules is the first thing you read. It's what they don't say that makes you fast. I've read rules that doesn't even mention that your car can't be powered. I know that's taking it a bit far. That's why there are the "forbidden" rules at most pro races. I was recently at a race where the only rules were weight, width, height and length. That's all there was. So I threw on some razor wheels I made and some I bought. I thought several parents were going to try and whip me. One guy kept saying real loud after any of our 6 cars raced "Those wheels are illegal." After a few minutes I asked him if he had read the rules. He said no. I said you better because these are legal wheels and that's why the officials let them race. Then after a closer inspection of his girls car it had aftermarket 1 gram BSA wheels on it. He was fast but behind all 6 of my cars. I say let them big babies cry!
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Post by LCD Racing on Apr 21, 2009 19:27:09 GMT -7
It seems that no matter how airtight the rules are, you always get a sore loser that gets things cinched down some more. Montana Council runs some of the strictest rules in the country. I've had scouts cars dq'd at the state level for being 1/8" shorter than 7"...etc, etc...
Sorry about the rules rant in the terminology section, so here's my definition:
Pure Stock: the rules where we get to do all the stuff we can't in Scouts.
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Post by ACME Racing on Apr 21, 2009 20:57:59 GMT -7
Cant or canting ='s Placing the rear axles at an angle as to run the wheel to the head of the axle. Also known as camber. Negative camber is where the top of the wheel is closer to the car than the bottom of the wheel. If the top of the wheel is further away from the body than the bottom is called positive camber. It seems that 2.5 degrees of negative camber is the norm.
Drift ='s The amount your car runs off of a strait line. This is done by steering the car's FDW. "I steered my car where it drifts 4 inches in 6 feet"
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Post by W Racing on Apr 21, 2009 23:03:31 GMT -7
Ironhead,
I hope you at least get to flip the block over and drill holes. The slots are very inacurate and it is not fair to the scout that gets a worse block to have to use the slots....
With regards to speed.
Place the rear axle as far back as the rules allow. Cars must balance at a point in front of the rear axle. So moving the rear axle back allows you to move the balance point back. Giving you more PE (potential Energy :-). This makes your car look like it is speeding up on the flat. Really everyone else is slowing down...
The front axle placement is not so easy to choose. The longer the wheelbase / car-width ratio the easier the car is to allign. Extended wheelbase cars are easier to allign.
Shorter wheelbase cars allow more aggressive COM placement.
Because for a given weight on the front dominant wheel the shorter wheelbase car will have a more aggressive COM
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Post by Ironhead on Apr 22, 2009 4:55:14 GMT -7
Morning W Racing ,my earlier reply to Cecil about my axles being politicaly incorrect was a couple years ago (less educated) and I think everything about this car was POLITICALY INCORRECT but lucky for us was quick. As long as our rules allow I will definitly be drilling and extending (rules better allow) we want to use "The Block" as soon as it arrives. And as always thanks guy for all your advice. Once the kids cars are all set the old man gets to play hope to be racing with you guys in the not to distant future.
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Post by resophonic1 on Apr 22, 2009 19:08:46 GMT -7
Ironhead my block shipped tonight....It should arrive the same time as my drill press. I'm looking forward to getting a few builds completed to see what it can do. I have bought just about every tool available from the other places, including the one that doubles as a paint stand . While they have performed ok, I'm looking to take our times to the next level with the block. We have finished 3rd overall each year in our pack, we are hoping to change that with the knowledge that has been shared on this site. I've read and been given some great advice already....I can't wait to apply some of it to a car. My first project is to modify our car from this year and send it in to the May 9th race to see If I can improve it with some tips from the PDDR gang. I hope the Ironhead gang does well next year...I'll be waiting for the results.
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Post by Ironhead on Apr 22, 2009 20:28:25 GMT -7
Sounds good I can't wait ,I'm in the same boat as you, time to MT the tool box and make room for "The Block" we are really anxious to get started on next years cars 2 for my boys and 1 for my daughter to enter in the family car division.Can't wait to get the kids squared away and then I can begin to concentrate on having some fun with the PDDR gang.We really have to get a handle on next year,my oldest boy is all done as a cub scout and has won everythin but first in the district .I just picked up my drill press today and tagged a belt/disc sander for my next investment.I will definetly let you know how we make and you also let us know how you and yours do.
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Post by psycaz on Apr 23, 2009 4:20:48 GMT -7
For those getting new Blocks, one tip. Make sure to get clamps that let you flip the Block over without riding on the clamp's end. Mine our Irwin and are very close (must be centered carefully), I have to make sure before I start drilling - didn't do that the first couple times. Once I filpped the Block, I was riding on the end of the clamp and not the Block, putting the holes off.
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Post by Ironhead on Apr 23, 2009 13:54:12 GMT -7
Thanks for the tip
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Post by 2FAST4U on Apr 23, 2009 15:04:29 GMT -7
For those getting new Blocks, one tip. Make sure to get clamps that let you flip the Block over without riding on the clamp's end. Mine our Irwin and are very close (must be centered carefully), I have to make sure before I start drilling - didn't do that the first couple times. Once I filpped the Block, I was riding on the end of the clamp and not the Block, putting the holes off. THAT IS WHY I USE THE BIG CLAMPS... FAT BY HAD A LITTLE FUN WITH ME ABOUT THE CLAMPS ON THE VIDEO, BUT GUESS WHAT THEY WORK AND ACTED LIKE TO BIG HANDLES TO HOLD ON TO WHAN I PICK IT UP... SO YES MAKE SURE WHEN YOU GET CLAMPS THEY DO NOT HANG LOWER THAN THE BLOCK... GOOD BOYS AND HAPPY DRILLING... GLENN
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Post by Ironhead on Apr 23, 2009 15:35:17 GMT -7
Thanks Glenn, I just received mine I will be trying it out tonight.
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