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Post by Road Runner Racing on Dec 17, 2007 20:32:10 GMT -7
HEY I MISSED ALL THE FUN... HERE IS MY THINKING... 4.0 OZ OF LEAD = 4.0 OZ OF TUNGSTEN BUT LET ME GO ONE STEP FURTHER... PEPTO, LEAD OR TUNGSTEN LET US KNOW... OUT BURST, LEAD POWERED COLD FUSION , LEAD POWERED TORMENT LEAD, POWERED SUPER DUTCH, LEAD POWERED OBI1, LEAD POWERED SILVER STREAK, LEAD POWERED BAKER BOYS , LEAD POWERED RAIL HUGERS, HANDMEDOWN LEAD POWERED MENACE LEAD, POWERED JUNGLE HUNT, LEAD POWERED METEOR , LEAD POWERED BLUEBAYOU , LEAD POWERED DERBY DESIGNS CARS, LEAD POWERED HAVE I MISSED ANY... OH E-BAY'S TOP CARS LEAD POWERED THIS IS MY REPORT, SO I SAY, USE WHAT WORKS BEST FOR YOU... BUT I WOULD SPEND MY MONEY ON WHEELS AND AXLES... 2FAST4U Uh........yea and it took awhile for Krytox to get noticed too. It wasn't until people started applying it correctly that it became an extremely popular lube for the top pinewood cars. All it will take is a Tungsten car to knock off one of the big cars and lead will be a "used to be good".I take my hat off to the guys still using lead. I was never fond of melting that stuff not to mention it is Toxic. To make your cars as fast as they are using lead is just amazing. You are all truely talented builders. I discovered Tungsten a couple of years ago and last year built the fastest car using Tungsten I have ever built in 9 years of building cars. Seven of the 9 years I used lead. The car was by far faster than anything I had ever built using lead. Most racers try to use Tungsten like they use lead and never take advantage of the ability to concentrate the weight. The ability to concentrate the weight in a very small area is the big advantage of Tungsten and if used correctly most racers will experience the benefits from this as well. If your going to use the 3/8 cylinders and spread them out on the rear of the car you might as well use lead. Anyone remember a racer called Warp Speed? He was one of the top racers around a couple of years ago in another league and he used a very concentrated form of Tungsten, not the little 3/8 inch cylinders or beads. He was always the car to beat. That is my story and I'm sticking to it. R??? Racing
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Post by 2FAST4U on Dec 17, 2007 21:28:18 GMT -7
HEY I MISSED ALL THE FUN... HERE IS MY THINKING... 4.0 OZ OF LEAD = 4.0 OZ OF TUNGSTEN BUT LET ME GO ONE STEP FURTHER... PEPTO, LEAD OR TUNGSTEN LET US KNOW... OUT BURST, LEAD POWERED COLD FUSION , LEAD POWERED TORMENT LEAD, POWERED SUPER DUTCH, LEAD POWERED OBI1, LEAD POWERED SILVER STREAK, LEAD POWERED BAKER BOYS , LEAD POWERED RAIL HUGERS, HANDMEDOWN LEAD POWERED MENACE LEAD, POWERED JUNGLE HUNT, LEAD POWERED METEOR , LEAD POWERED BLUEBAYOU , LEAD POWERED DERBY DESIGNS CARS, LEAD POWERED HAVE I MISSED ANY... OH E-BAY'S TOP CARS LEAD POWERED THIS IS MY REPORT, SO I SAY, USE WHAT WORKS BEST FOR YOU... BUT I WOULD SPEND MY MONEY ON WHEELS AND AXLES... 2FAST4U Uh........yea and it took awhile for Krytox to get noticed too. It wasn't until people started applying it correctly that it became an extremely popular lube for the top pinewood cars. All it will take is a Tungsten car to knock off one of the big cars and lead will be a "used to be good".I take my hat off to the guys still using lead. I was never fond of melting that stuff not to mention it is Toxic. To make your cars as fast as they are using lead is just amazing. You are all truely talented builders. I discovered Tungsten a couple of years ago and last year built the fastest car using Tungsten I have ever built in 9 years of building cars. Seven of the 9 years I used lead. The car was by far faster than anything I had ever built using lead. Most racers try to use Tungsten like they use lead and never take advantage of the ability to concentrate the weight. The ability to concentrate the weight in a very small area is the big advantage of Tungsten and if used correctly most racers will experience the benefits from this as well. If your going to use the 3/8 cylinders and spread them out on the rear of the car you might as well use lead. Anyone remember a racer called Warp Speed? He was one of the top racers around a couple of years ago in another league and he used a very concentrated form of Tungsten, not the little 3/8 inch cylinders or beads. He was always the car to beat. That is my story and I'm sticking to it. R??? Racing ALRIGHT A NEW GUY TALKING ABOUT STUFF... WELCOME.... WELL NOT TO BURST YOUR BUBBLE BUT I HAVE SOME KRYTOX FOR SALE FOR CHEEP... YOU CAN STICK WITH IT IF YOU WANT... WE USE HOB E LUBE... EVERY CAR THAT I RACED AND WON AT LIMA 2007 WAS LUBED WITH GOOD OLD GRAPHITE / HOB E LUBE... ;D OH AND IN 2006 LIMA LAND OPEN, SILVER STEAK AND OUTRAGE POWERED BY LEAD AND LUBED WITH GRAPHITE / HOB E LUBE TOOK OUT YOUR FAMOUS WARPSPEED... AND HE HAS NOT BEEN TO A RACE SENCE... AGAIN WELCOME TO PDDR HAVE FUN 2FAST4U
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Post by P D D R 2 on Dec 17, 2007 23:15:00 GMT -7
? ? ? Racing ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D
Wow... pretty impressive for a guy that hasn't raced anywhere yet... but thats ok
Your more than welcome to come and show us all what Pinewood Derby is all about... (I remember that was said before by someone) We was told once before by someone from another league a year ago... { or show up... and put your cars on the track and let them do the talkin.} It will be great to get some more competition to the league, we welcome all new comers to come and give it a try. We thrive on competition thats whats makes this whole thing so fun. ;D ;D You wanna know something else? It happened back in Sept 2006 Lima Land Open. I remember a guy that showed up there with a really big book that had allot of stuff pertaining Pinewood derby phyisics. He leaned over to the starter of the race and said... "I'm going to show you guys what Pinewood Derby is all about"
But when his car didn't even place in the top 20 I'm sure he wished he would (he placed 21st of of 27 with 15thousnth's wire axles and full of tungsten) Thats the thing now days with advertising, people like to say stuff to make what ever there trying to market or preach sound like this is the best way ... any one can write books post messages in a message board and write adds on the web, but to back up what they preach is a nother thing.There's a whole lot more to building a derby car than just weight and lube... I'm sure that everyone else here would love to see what you have been working on. Send it in, your more than welcome. Here's your chance you have until February 2, 2008 to prepare.Don't forget the "King of the Hill Tournament" December 1, 2008 for all those who qualify.
Have fun
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Post by Road Runner Racing on Dec 18, 2007 0:30:24 GMT -7
ALRIGHT A NEW GUY TALKING ABOUT STUFF... WELCOME.... WELL NOT TO BURST YOUR BUBBLE BUT I HAVE SOME KRYTOX FOR SALE FOR CHEEP... YOU CAN STICK WITH IT IF YOU WANT... WE USE HOB E LUBE... EVERY CAR THAT I RACED AND WON AT LIMA 2007 WAS LUBED WITH GOOD OLD GRAPHITE / HOB E LUBE... OH AND IN 2006 LIMA LAND OPEN, SILVER STEAK AND OUTRAGE POWERED BY LEAD AND LUBED WITH GRAPHITE / HOB E LUBE TOOK OUT YOUR FAMOUS WARPSPEED... AND HE HAS NOT BEEN TO A RACE SENCE... AGAIN WELCOME TO PDDR HAVE FUN 2FAST4U Whoa, is everyone on this board this touchy when someone expresses a different opinion?New Guy? No I have been around for awhile. I don't post very much and I have not been to the site in a bit. Burst my Bubble? Not at all, I will take all of the Krytox you would like to ship me. You obviously are very good with your method of application of Hobby Lube. I have tried Hobby lube and it worked like sand. How can we have two completely different experiences with the same material? Because whatever material you are using has to be used or applied a certain way to get the best results. This just proves the point I was trying to make in my previous post, the correct usage or technique for the material (Tungsten) you are using can make a huge difference in the outcome. You have obviously found the sweet spot or the best application technique for Hobby Lube and you certainly know how to get the most out of Lead. I am sure your application or technique in using both materials has improved from the first time you used them until now. Whereas other racers may have a technique with Tube O Lube or Krytox that gets them the kind of results you get with Hobby Lube. Actually that is what makes Pinewood so interesting and fun. It is not just a matter of finding the best materials for building a car, each type of material can require a special application or technique that we end up constantly trying to improve or perfect which always seems to be a moving target in Pinewood racing! As a result the cars just keep getting better and better. Will we ever find the absolute Holy Grail for type of Lubricant, Weight, Wheels, Axles, Location of COM, etc., etc for a Pinewood Derby Car? My famous Warp Speed?? I never met the guy. I just remember he was the guy to beat a few years ago and seemed to be on the cutting edge of car building at the time. I guess it by the way you are boasting about beating him verifies that you agree he was the guy to beat as well. You are suggesting he quit because you beat him? I was thinking he hasn't been around for a while because he has been making so much money on the Derby wheels he developed that he may have graduated to racing in Nascar. Hey brothers 2FAST4U and A1nogoslo relax, you guys are suppose to be the administrators not the TERMINATORS! From the cars I have seen that you guys have built over the last couple of years as well as the trophys I saw in the Lima video you guy's are definately great car builders. This doesn't necessarily mean there isn't some technique or material a little better out there. I am sure you guys will find a way to make your cars a little faster. In Pinewood there always seems to be a better material or a better way. That is what makes it so fun. The Rat Rod is one of my favorites, really nice. R??? Racing
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Post by lumberjackracing on Dec 18, 2007 0:57:47 GMT -7
Derby heat its like building a fire and using pinewood. I love Pinewood ? ? ? Racing wrote I read it like this: I think the point that the two brothers are telling you is why don't you then show everyone the proper usage and technique for the materials that you speak of. Send one in and it should be a good race.
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Post by 2FAST4U on Dec 18, 2007 2:33:41 GMT -7
? ? ? racing it is not being touchy it is just stating facts that I have found that works and prov-en to work, there is no touchy here... just as you say what works for you, krytox and tungsten... you came out and said that if someone beats a lead car it will be "use to be good" and said that krytox is the way to go with the top builders... well I would consider my self a top builder and would defend graphite over krytox... I have run many test and have spent over a 1000 dollars on lubes and I have found that hob e lube runs the best for us... like I said use what works best for you... so don't take it personal if i speak my mind and share what works for us... now about Warpspeed you brought him in the picture TALKING ABOUT HIS TUNGSTEN METHODS... NO BOASTING HERE JUST STATED FACTS NOT FICTION... again welcome and you are right you have been here since Feb of 2007 sorry about that, just have not seen you around for awhile... hope to see you at the races... Glenn / 2fast4u
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Post by race2win on Jun 1, 2008 16:30:17 GMT -7
PM me, I have some options for you for Tg. TG is 100% the way to go. The melting point is too high to bother with, however if you plan ahead you will not need to drill anything out and the powder will allow super-fine adjustments in or out of a cavity - and no need to melt. I have no problem with lead or melting it, however to get the placement density Tg is almost twice as effective, its a molecular weight thing
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Post by F.A.S.T Racing on Jun 1, 2008 18:07:07 GMT -7
I have no problem with lead or melting it, however to get the placement density Tg is almost twice as effective, its a molecular weight thing Tell me more about Tg...
My Periodic Table does not list it..... If you are referring to Tungsten, the Atomic Symbol is : W
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Post by race2win on Jun 1, 2008 21:17:16 GMT -7
TG would be the shortest effective abbreviation in common use - seems logical enough
However now that you are there you will be able to look up lead (pb) and be able to decide based on the facts precisely where the greatest density is...
;D
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Post by P D D R 2 on Jun 2, 2008 0:14:20 GMT -7
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Post by antlarin813 on Apr 6, 2012 21:57:15 GMT -7
Here is my thinking and I'm no expert but this is what I have observed and pondered. The rear bottom of your car is on the down slope the longest and the more mass you can get in this area will give you the most thrust to push you forward in the straight. just don't cram so much in there that makes your COG too far back. This is where your car design comes into play and axel placement.
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Post by John Thawley on Apr 7, 2012 13:57:28 GMT -7
Here is my thinking and I'm no expert but this is what I have observed and pondered. The rear bottom of your car is on the down slope the longest and the more mass you can get in this area will give you the most thrust to push you forward in the straight. just don't cram so much in there that makes your COG too far back. This is where your car design comes into play and axel placement. This thread is pushing 4+ years old. I'm guessing most of these folks have quietly (or not) moved on to tungsten and probably oil.
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Post by antlarin813 on Apr 10, 2012 5:11:35 GMT -7
I'm kinda new at this but I have pondered this and maybe some of you guys can prove me wrong but... The bottom rear corner of the car is on the down slope the longest and if you fill this section with the most dense product (tungsten) then gravity will take effect gaining larger effects. Now maybe these effects are minute or I'm over-thinking this. Outside of this area it doesn't matter really what you use due to you not aiming for density more for COG. Now you do want your weights as low as possible.
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auburn
PDDR Forum Member
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Post by auburn on May 20, 2012 8:06:04 GMT -7
Hey guys- I am new here and could not help but throw in my source for cheap tungsten. If you have a Hobby Lobby store in your area you can go to HobbyLobby.com and search around- they always have a 40% Discount coupon you can print off. I usually print 2 or 3 and buy tungsten plates, Testors paint & misc things I need. I know this post is old but I wanted to throw in my source to help since I know I'm eventually going to have questions with my future builds. Hope this helps any of you.
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